Interesting Analysis of the governments in 12 Kingdoms

[zitch]

I had found this interesting analysis on theokatu.com about the political climate in 12K:

http://articles.theotaku.com/view.php?a ... ve&id=1556

Here, the author is comparing the governing systems in 12 Kingdoms to ancient China, modern-day Japan, and even to the French Revolution.

Might not be much really new (though the Reign of Terror comparison is something I didn't think of), but interesting read, nontheless.

[Shanonn]

Great article you found. Interesting read.
Shanonn

[KingofSith]

That's a very interesting political analysis of the Twelve Kingdoms and i would like for us to discuss some of the political implications of this great work of art... thanx for the article, very interesting...

[zitch]

Actually, as interesting as the article is, I do have to disagree with some of it:

It is worth noting that the Emperors of the two most successful kingdoms were actually born on Earth.

Here, the article is talking about En and Kei, and I have to disagree. First of all, Kei is far too young under Youko's leadership to be considered one of the most successful kingdoms. It may be taking its first steps there, it may have the potential to be the most successful, but I cannot say it is there by any degree. Second of all, En is not even the oldest kingdom, though I do not think age alone can be used as a measure of success, it is a good indicator from what is implied in the series. A country in the south is older, I forget which one (Someone please help me here... My memory's failing... )

We only really know about En and Kei because those are the two main kingdoms the anime talks about. We do know a bit about Kou and Hou, and smaller bits of Kyou, and Ryou, and maybe a random fact or two about the rest of the kingdoms, but that's really all we're exposed to (in the anime, at least).

[nightchaser]

Yeah - Sou is 600 years old (in one episode it was mentioned that was a record because no country had ever reached that age before). En is 500 years and Han is next at 300 years. Ryuu is 120 years and failing. Kyou is 90 years and we have no info on them.

You are right though because it is presumptious to call Kei successful. They are still having a lot of problems. But that just makes for more stories, right? I do believe that if Kei is successful the political climate of the 12 kingdoms could change. Youko's experience with politics (as limited as it is since she never paid attention to that stuff when she was in Horai) is with 1990's Japan. She can't help but bring some of that back with her. Hence her abolishment of prostration.

[KingofSith]

absolutly right, sou and en are the longest ruling dynasties of all the kingdoms. I am with nightcasher when pointing out that key have the potential to become as succesful as the other two. First, because Youko is a taika and second because all the struggle that had plague the new queen since her ascension. Lets face it, one of the catalist for both a good or bad governenment is the turmoil and chaos before a new government comes to power, either the new government will learn from it and become stronger and well balanced or become stagnated and more corrupt. I dont think that will happen to kei, Youko throughout the anime and books has demostrated the ability to get the job done through a lot of difficulty. Her inexperience had made her path more steep than it should have been, but she seems able to pull it off everytime, which it is the mark of a very capable ruler, she is learning to cope with the burden of command quiet well and is smart enough to realize that she cant do it alone.
So i do believe Kei has the potential, and also King En has a very real interest in having a strong and rich kei, cause been neighbors, is there trouble, it will spill over to his own kingdom, which tells us that he will be guiding Youko through the worst of times...what you think?

[zitch]

I talked to the author of the article; when she said most successful, she meant En and Sou. I didn't think Sou's emperor was a taika, but I could be wrong.

[nightchaser]

One of the anime episodes has Rokuta describing all the rulers and he says the only Taika are En-ou and Kei-ou. So Sou-ou is just a "normal" dude It's probably just one of those "wrote the sentence backwards" kind of things. I do that

[Jinx999]

Actually Hou's government appears to be based on a Chinese legal philosophy called legalism, which was favoured by a notable Emperor (the guy in Hero). It led to a famous incident when a bunch of soldiers were sitting by a road on their way to a posting. The conversation went something like this:

"What is the penalty for being late?"

"Death."

"What is the penalty for rebellion?"

"Death."

"I've got some news for you guys. We're late."

[sk]

That was a fairly interesting article.
I do have to admit one of the main reasons why I've been so addicted to the 12k is becuase of system of government.
It seems ideal (as long as you're a ruler :p)

I disagree with the fact that King En doesn't care about rank much. I believe he does, the reason why it seems like he doesn't is becuase it comes naturally to him, he was born a "prince' and became a king. He doesn't care about appreances and the way people are 'casual' with him becuase he knows ultimately he is on top.

----possible spoiler---

The King of Sou has been around for i think 629 ish years? In the last story of Kasho no Yume, Rikou meantions that there's been only one other example of a kingdom lasting longer than Sou has, and there's only about 30-40years until Sou becomes the longest run kingdom in the modern 12k history (since the 12k's were once destroyed by the Tentei)
( I REALLY hope they animate the Sou family and their story)

---end

Other than that, I think Kei will have a long hard road ahead of it, and I believe the "tentei" placed that infront of Youko on purpose. Think, if Youko had just been brought back from Hourai without having to claw her way through Kou and En to find keiki, she would have just been another clueless queen. Even with her previous travels she still had to go live with the regular people to get a feel. Each road block is tough on Youko, and she does get by it.. but without the troubles she wouldn't 'make it'.. . ( am I making sence here?)

Another thing that i believe is key in the world of 12k is the fact that there is no Oil (mentioned in the first book) Which means that there won't be any extreme science advances (no plastics ..etc)...

...kk.. just my 2 cents in the matter.

[zitch]

Another thing that i believe is key in the world of 12k is the fact that there is no Oil (mentioned in the first book) Which means that there won't be any extreme science advances (no plastics ..etc)...

...kk.. just my 2 cents in the matter.

Of course. Oil and coal comes from dead plants and animals over a period of millions of years ago! I'm guessing this world Tentei has created isn't old enough to even produce such materials, yet. I'm also curious of if the land rebuilds itself (I.E., landslides does happen. I wonder if the land is slowly eroding away, or if there's more magical properties that prevent such erosion, or if there's some "tectonic plate" type movements that rebuild the lands...).

The lack of technology and sciences can also be attributed to the lack of major wars and conflicts between countries. Since rulers are largely forbidden from interfering in the affairs of another country, such wars are not sustainable. Any conflict are usually internal to each country. Also, the kingdoms don't try to compete in any aspect with each other; they tend to be more worried about their own internal affairs than what others are doing (exception is Kou, but look how long he lasted...).

If you look at our own history for the past hundred years, the biggest technological advances occured because of wars and conflicts between major countries. The World Wars (1 and 2) brought us radio, jet engines, nuclear sciences. Even our first computers were originally developed to help aim guns on battleships (so they don't have to calculate by hand, etc.). More recent example is the Cold War between the U.S. and the U.S.S.R. That, and the "we have to do better than them" metality brought us the Space Race, which gave us numerous technological enhancements.

So basically, the lack of conflict in this world keeps them technologically and scientifically "retarded", if you compare them to the our world. There's just little need and interest for such development, people are too busy just trying to survive, for the most part. Even if there is coal and oil in this world, I'd bet there's little interest in developing machines that can make use of them to do useful work.

[nightchaser]

The Kaikyaku Youko met when she arrived in En was a science teacher at a "community college". So there must be some kind of science. Medicine seems to include surgery - which of course is advanced science. I suspect there is also astronomy, zoology, agriculture, and botany. There is also a minister that deals with technology and enchantments so perhaps "magic" is also a science.

As far as technology - they have sailing ships and carts with wheels (sounds basic to us, but many older civilizations didn't use wheels). They have looms for weaving fabric. Steam could be used in a small way (it would require a fuel source - charcoal would work but it would require a lot).

War is one way that technological advances come about. Another is discovery. A race to be the first one to see the top of a mountain or the land accross the sea. However, in the 12 kingdoms that can't be done. There is nothing left to discover in that respect. Apparently they do try to sail accross the Sea to Horai occassionaly because I remember reading that the ships always run out of food (so there are no islands or perhaps even fish when you get away from the continent). However, there is discovery in other forms. There are people who hang out at the Riboku's in the forest and search for new species of plants. The Kaikyaku's bring new ideas so there must be people working from that aspect as well.

[Tahki]

Possibly because of this mindset that 12Kingdom's is considered flat?
(see other thread on Flat or Round)

[Jinx999]

IIRC, in the novels, Youko sees a clock tower when she arrives in En. Clocks are a fairly complex technology and having a clock tower implies that the culture is sophisticated enough that knowing the time is important.